Changing track tempo...

ichabod Aug 6, 2004

  1. ichabod

    ichabod Member

    Threads:
    87
    Messages:
    813
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Bristol
    Do you choose a tempo at the start and then stick by your guns? I have decided I want to change it half way through making the tune...

    I have problems trying to keep a track in a state where you can alter the tempo without messing everything up. Reverse cymbals type sounds etc triggered via midi no longer fit (can this be remedied by setting up the sampler differently?)... what I really need is a sampler with a pitch shift which automatically locks to the track tempo to keep all of the samples the same comparative length - does one exist?

    Also if you have bounced anynthing down to audio it all needs re-doing. Its a nightmare. Has anyone got any tactics for doing this more easily or should I just give up and live with the tempo I've got?
     
  2. Crispy

    Crispy Fried for too long

    Threads:
    48
    Messages:
    623
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    London
    aright dude!
    Hope your well!
    yea i reckon its worth having a fiddle with changing the tempos in tunes, so keep fiddling (bit tricky for the djs, Hahaha :lol: )
    spose you just have to make your mind up earlier on about the tempo change before you do too much bouncing. re the sampler thing, i dont think theres a way of it automatically changing (nice idea though), think you just have to re program the length of da notes.

    there are quite a few programs which deal with timestretching quickly i think which would make it easier with the audio (i think ableton live can change audio tempos on the fly!)


    hows the tune coming along? what sort of style is it?


    take it easy.... :smoke:
    :Grin:
     
  3. norty303

    norty303 Member (Todger)

    Threads:
    48
    Messages:
    1,998
    Likes Received:
    28
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    East Sussex
    Why not just write the track at the same tempo all the way thru but take into account the place you want the tempo to change. You can then bounce to audio and select the section you want faster/slower and change it's tempo leaving the pitch intact
     
  4. Little Nemo

    Little Nemo Member

    Threads:
    14
    Messages:
    411
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    London UK
    yea its a funny old problem..

    time stretching seems to generally destrort any samples rendering an almightily scary sound - yessss- but doesnt necessarily have the correct tempo change you require...
    which is strange as the technology exists to spin cd's as a dj, with constant pitch...
    oh well. can anyone recommend an excellent time stretcher...?

    its easy for a track to change over the duration of its making, so it can seem to be a problem, but if its a very small variation maybe you should leave it- if kicks at 120 it will kick at 140..

    ichabod- dont forget that when played out, the dj can alter the speed...!
     
  5. SpudBlud

    SpudBlud Junior Members

    Threads:
    1
    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Kontakt has an option to set how long you want a sample to run for in beats/bars.. it will then stretch or shrink the sample to fit. I imagine it would cope with tempo changes ok..

    :wizard1:
     
  6. soliptic

    soliptic whirling mathematician

    Threads:
    59
    Messages:
    1,303
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    sw19
    i think its worth trying as it extends your range of stuff to pull out at people... however i also agree its a real pain in the arse when you only decide to do it really late into the game, with tons of stuff bounced to audio etc... I've only done it once (in this track: http://www.transfigurate.com/dart/soliptic__time_perception_(the_nightmare_of_cake).mp3 ) , i had to decide i was doing it from the outset and more or less do that bit first, or at least always remeber i was going to do that, thats the only practical way for me.....
     
  7. Reconstructed

    Reconstructed Member

    Threads:
    31
    Messages:
    732
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Baltimore, Maryland
    I've put fermatas in a couple tracks I'm working on. Usually in the intro. I just downpitch the tempo track at the last note before the fermata hits and then speed it back up right before the next measure starts.

    I've put a couple of blatant tempo changes too, at the ends of sections. Like a break will be brought down to a dubby 73bpm while the chorus and rest of the track is up around 110. I've thought about doing that and then speeding the break back up gradually to the normal tempo before it ends but haven't so far. I like it when music isn't so quantized and DJ-friendly.
     
  8. ichabod

    ichabod Member

    Threads:
    87
    Messages:
    813
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Bristol
    Hia Chris - how are you doing? - Heard rumours of a party by you guys last weekend - did it come to fruit?

    its a fairly laid back progressive tune (bit too laid back I've decided - hence the tempo change). My first attempt at trance (and only the third tune Ive written full stop) so still a bit rough around the edges.

    Possibly didn't word my question properly :? I'm not aiming for Hallucinogen style tempo changes - just want to alter the tempo of the entire track... I'm starting to think that the best method would be to wait until it is complete then mixdown all the non-tempo crtical stuff (midi drums etc) at the new tempo but do a seperate mixdown of all of the audio tracks at the original tempo then perform a single timestrech on this.

    Cubases advanced mode timestreatch sounds promising (I guess this is an adaptive algorithm which treats transients and sustained notes in different ways?) - this has got to be better than the constant pitch timestretching on a CD deck (judging by the time it takes on a 3GHz pc it must involve a huge amount of number crunching)

    Spudblud - thats really interesting about Kontakt - I've always been too lazy to explore all of its features.. have to start using that to avoid the same problems again :cool:
     
  9. ichabod

    ichabod Member

    Threads:
    87
    Messages:
    813
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Bristol
    If I ever finish (progress extremely slow :? ) it I'll try and put it on the web for a bit of constructive/destructive criticism - would be really useful - I havn't played it to anyone yet. Maybe it would be best to put it up before it's completely finished for some advice on EQing and mixing etc?
     
  10. SpudBlud

    SpudBlud Junior Members

    Threads:
    1
    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    yeah its amazing what you can learn by reading the manual! :Grin:

    I used it for about 2 years before reading it and theres so much more that you can do with it i didnt realise. Makes me think i should read the cubase manual at some point..
     
  11. ichabod

    ichabod Member

    Threads:
    87
    Messages:
    813
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Bristol
    I'm hoping the next edition of cubase will have a built in sampler - there could be far more integration than you get with VSTis. Do you know if Kontakt has a feature to collect all samples together into a single directory? (I seem to remember fruity loops did this)
    It is impossible for me to back up a track - the samples from kontakt are spread all over the harddrive. It would also speed things up when using DFD if all the files were located in one physical area of the disk. Guess its time to delve into that manual :?
     
  12. Fromem_Ory

    Fromem_Ory Shantidisestablishment

    Threads:
    205
    Messages:
    5,136
    Likes Received:
    47
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    London
    i had an idea once, because a few of my tracks which i wrote at 142 bpm i want to play live at 144 bpm, but they have to be exact. this is pretty mathematical (for me).
    this is what i'm gonna do:
    i'm gonna write out a synth note thats like 64 bars long at 142 bpm. then burn it to audio. then change the track tempo to 144 bpm, and calculate how much longer it is in the form of a percentage, how much i have to time stretch it to get it to fit to 64 bars @144 bpm, as a percentage. then just timestretch my tracks by that percentage, and surely it would work?
    confused?
    i am...
    would this work?
    ...full flight...
     
  13. JPsychodelicacy

    JPsychodelicacy Studio Elf

    Threads:
    49
    Messages:
    9,075
    Likes Received:
    197
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    London SE19
    Yes it would, but most timestretching algorithms allow you to input source and destination BPM values and it does the working out for you.

    Remember, though that even the best timestretching algorithms *will* cause some anomalies to appear in he sound, especially if you are slowing tempo down, so always work on copies of your audio file if you don't want to lose definition in your original sounds.

    J.
     
  14. ichabod

    ichabod Member

    Threads:
    87
    Messages:
    813
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Bristol
    If your timestretch doesn't have bpm settings you don't need to do the thing with the synth note... just timestetch to: 142/144 = 98.6% of the original length
     
Loading...
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice