Zero-G
Zero-G
ID cards in the UK seem like a good idea for some people and a breach of human rights for others, what do you think ?
ID Cards
- Thread starter Zero-G
- Start date
PLEASE VOTE HERE ALSO AND FORWARD A COPY TO EVERYONE YOU KNOW
just got this on the wire this mornin...
may be your last chance to formaly give notice of your disappointment with our government (before they already know in advance, along with everything else about you)::
-----------------
ID CARDS. TRUE COST LIKELY TO BE £300 A PERSON. DOESN'T TACKLE TERRORISM, FRAUD OR IDENTITY THREAT. BASED ON NATIONAL DATABASE THAT TRACKS INDIVIDUAL ACTIONS THROUGHOUT LIFE. UNPRECEDENTED IN PEACE TIME. SECOND READING OF ID CARDS BILL Tuesday. http://www.owos.info/idcardfreezone/action.php TO TAKE ACTION.
Dear Friend
How do you feel about an ID card scheme being foisted on the British people that even George Bush described as too ‘illiberal’ when a similar scheme was proposed in the US?
If you’re not sure where you stand on ID cards please still take a minute to read on because there’s a lot we’re not being told by the Government.
The fact is this is not just about a simple identity card: it is actually more about a national surveillance infrastructure - called the National Identity Register - based on the most comprehensive database of personal information ever devised in any country. It could even include the police DNA database, GCHQ electronic surveillance database and phone & internet surfing records.
This database lies behind the ID card scheme. It is nothing like the ID card this country had in the war and is wider in scope than any other European ID card - it is more like schemes adopted in very authoritarian countries, where the police have access to the personal details of every citizen.
I’m writing to you and all Our World Our Say supporters to ask you to take urgent action now to persuade MPs that the British people will not accept this scheme. Go to http://www.owos.info/idcardfreezone/action.php.
This Tuesday, the 28th May, the ID Cards Bill will receive its’ second reading. You and I and all who care must ensure that MPs and Home Secretary Charles Clarke receive a massive wake up call from voters.
In Australia, in New Zealand and in Canada voters have rejected such a scheme. We must do the same here in Britain.
It will enable all state bodies and even commercial organisations to access a whole raft of information about who we are and what we do. Right through our life every action through officialdom will be recorded. You and I will have little control over the use of this data.
It may be too illiberal for the US but Home Secretary Charles Clarke and Tony Blair clearly think it’s not too illiberal for Britain. You and I must prove them wrong.
In the early stages the scheme will be voluntary - but you won’t be able to work, you won’t be able to access the health service and you won’t be able to get a passport without becoming part of the scheme. And the government has admitted that the scheme will become compulsory.
Imagine having to queue to get your fingerprints and retina scanned - and having to pay a significant amount for the privilege of receiving a card. The fact is the total cost has been estimated by the London School of Economics to be at least £300 per person. The actual cost to you and I may be subsidised by selling the data to private companies but it is still likely to be substantial.
If you don’t turn up to your appointment to have your fingerprints, face and retina scanned then you face a fine of £2,500. You could go to prison for up to two years if you don’t sign up for a card. To back the bill up a whole range of new offences are being created - which threaten to make criminals out of thousands of ordinary people.
Why is this card being introduced? None of the Governments arguments stack up. They won’t prevent terrorism. All the terrorists who committed the Madrid bombing had legitimate ID cards. Elsewhere in the world ID cards have done nothing to stop terrorism.
They won’t stop benefit fraud. 90% of benefit fraud is by people using their real identity. They won’t stop illegal immigration. All of the evidence of ID card schemes is that as soon as they are established a trade starts in forged cards. And minority ethnic groups are also concerned because the scheme may be used by bigoted officials to harass them.
The cost will be horrendous. The London School of Economics study estimates that the total cost of this scheme could be as much as £18 billion pounds. That could buy a lot of schools and hospitals. The government denies this but if a recent leak to Private Eye is true then the Passport Office is already working on the basis that the cards will cost £300 each to implement.
On top of this the technology is completely unproven. The planned ID card scheme in Australia was driven out by the failure of the technology and massive public opposition.
Help build a bandwagon against the ID Cards Bill. Take action now by:
* contacting your MP and telling him or her why they must vote against this bill. You will be redirected from the Our World Our Say to writetothem.com
* emailing the Home Secretary
* declaring your home an ID cards free zone.
Together we must show the Government that the British people have caught on to exactly what this bill means. Go to http://www.owos.info/idcardfreezone/action.php. and take these actions now.
It’s vital that we do all we can to wake up the British people to a development that is the most draconian enforcement of a national identity card scheme and database in peace time. We have little time to prevent this becoming law.
Yours
Rob Whitehead
Development Manager, Our World Our Say
PS: It has been revealed that the government has been asked to consider making the national database underlying the ID card scheme accessible to the American authorities. Please take action today to prevent this scheme becoming law.
You can download an ID card free zone poster from http://www.owos.info/idcardfreezone/OWOS-IDCARDS.pdf to put up in your window.
We planning to place adverts in the national press next week about ID cards. To make a donation to OWOS please go to http://www.owos.info/make_a_donation/donate.php
To see if there is a local no2id group to get involved with go to: www.no2id.net
To check your contact details go to: http:/www.owos.info/frmCheck.php?cd=53347&key=76949
To unsubscribe yourself from the OWOS mailing list, please go to:
http:/www.owos.info/cancel.php?cd=53347&key=76949 or email unsubscribe@ourworldoursay.org
Our World Our Say works to give people a voice over world-changing issues. Through re-connecting ordinary citizens with their elected representatives and giving them a voice, we aim to give people power over their own future
just got this on the wire this mornin...
may be your last chance to formaly give notice of your disappointment with our government (before they already know in advance, along with everything else about you)::
-----------------
ID CARDS. TRUE COST LIKELY TO BE £300 A PERSON. DOESN'T TACKLE TERRORISM, FRAUD OR IDENTITY THREAT. BASED ON NATIONAL DATABASE THAT TRACKS INDIVIDUAL ACTIONS THROUGHOUT LIFE. UNPRECEDENTED IN PEACE TIME. SECOND READING OF ID CARDS BILL Tuesday. http://www.owos.info/idcardfreezone/action.php TO TAKE ACTION.
Dear Friend
How do you feel about an ID card scheme being foisted on the British people that even George Bush described as too ‘illiberal’ when a similar scheme was proposed in the US?
If you’re not sure where you stand on ID cards please still take a minute to read on because there’s a lot we’re not being told by the Government.
The fact is this is not just about a simple identity card: it is actually more about a national surveillance infrastructure - called the National Identity Register - based on the most comprehensive database of personal information ever devised in any country. It could even include the police DNA database, GCHQ electronic surveillance database and phone & internet surfing records.
This database lies behind the ID card scheme. It is nothing like the ID card this country had in the war and is wider in scope than any other European ID card - it is more like schemes adopted in very authoritarian countries, where the police have access to the personal details of every citizen.
I’m writing to you and all Our World Our Say supporters to ask you to take urgent action now to persuade MPs that the British people will not accept this scheme. Go to http://www.owos.info/idcardfreezone/action.php.
This Tuesday, the 28th May, the ID Cards Bill will receive its’ second reading. You and I and all who care must ensure that MPs and Home Secretary Charles Clarke receive a massive wake up call from voters.
In Australia, in New Zealand and in Canada voters have rejected such a scheme. We must do the same here in Britain.
It will enable all state bodies and even commercial organisations to access a whole raft of information about who we are and what we do. Right through our life every action through officialdom will be recorded. You and I will have little control over the use of this data.
It may be too illiberal for the US but Home Secretary Charles Clarke and Tony Blair clearly think it’s not too illiberal for Britain. You and I must prove them wrong.
In the early stages the scheme will be voluntary - but you won’t be able to work, you won’t be able to access the health service and you won’t be able to get a passport without becoming part of the scheme. And the government has admitted that the scheme will become compulsory.
Imagine having to queue to get your fingerprints and retina scanned - and having to pay a significant amount for the privilege of receiving a card. The fact is the total cost has been estimated by the London School of Economics to be at least £300 per person. The actual cost to you and I may be subsidised by selling the data to private companies but it is still likely to be substantial.
If you don’t turn up to your appointment to have your fingerprints, face and retina scanned then you face a fine of £2,500. You could go to prison for up to two years if you don’t sign up for a card. To back the bill up a whole range of new offences are being created - which threaten to make criminals out of thousands of ordinary people.
Why is this card being introduced? None of the Governments arguments stack up. They won’t prevent terrorism. All the terrorists who committed the Madrid bombing had legitimate ID cards. Elsewhere in the world ID cards have done nothing to stop terrorism.
They won’t stop benefit fraud. 90% of benefit fraud is by people using their real identity. They won’t stop illegal immigration. All of the evidence of ID card schemes is that as soon as they are established a trade starts in forged cards. And minority ethnic groups are also concerned because the scheme may be used by bigoted officials to harass them.
The cost will be horrendous. The London School of Economics study estimates that the total cost of this scheme could be as much as £18 billion pounds. That could buy a lot of schools and hospitals. The government denies this but if a recent leak to Private Eye is true then the Passport Office is already working on the basis that the cards will cost £300 each to implement.
On top of this the technology is completely unproven. The planned ID card scheme in Australia was driven out by the failure of the technology and massive public opposition.
Help build a bandwagon against the ID Cards Bill. Take action now by:
* contacting your MP and telling him or her why they must vote against this bill. You will be redirected from the Our World Our Say to writetothem.com
* emailing the Home Secretary
* declaring your home an ID cards free zone.
Together we must show the Government that the British people have caught on to exactly what this bill means. Go to http://www.owos.info/idcardfreezone/action.php. and take these actions now.
It’s vital that we do all we can to wake up the British people to a development that is the most draconian enforcement of a national identity card scheme and database in peace time. We have little time to prevent this becoming law.
Yours
Rob Whitehead
Development Manager, Our World Our Say
PS: It has been revealed that the government has been asked to consider making the national database underlying the ID card scheme accessible to the American authorities. Please take action today to prevent this scheme becoming law.
You can download an ID card free zone poster from http://www.owos.info/idcardfreezone/OWOS-IDCARDS.pdf to put up in your window.
We planning to place adverts in the national press next week about ID cards. To make a donation to OWOS please go to http://www.owos.info/make_a_donation/donate.php
To see if there is a local no2id group to get involved with go to: www.no2id.net
To check your contact details go to: http:/www.owos.info/frmCheck.php?cd=53347&key=76949
To unsubscribe yourself from the OWOS mailing list, please go to:
http:/www.owos.info/cancel.php?cd=53347&key=76949 or email unsubscribe@ourworldoursay.org
Our World Our Say works to give people a voice over world-changing issues. Through re-connecting ordinary citizens with their elected representatives and giving them a voice, we aim to give people power over their own future
D
dave arc-i
Guest
this might well lead to mass civil disobedience something that might finally make the goverment wake up and smell the coffee - what they going to do? bung EVERYBODY in prison after screwing up the court system by completely overloading it? or introduce detention without trial (contrary to human rights) and gthen where they going to put us all - the prison system has only room for about 2 more people currently!
Monkey Do
#1 Internet Toughguy
Anyone listen to Radio 4 this morning? Basically it seems that the governments plan goes something like this:
Get the ID card bill pushed through
Then find out how much it's going to cost
If the LSE proves to be closer to the mark they will can it because the biometric passport thing which we (they) are already committed to pretty much does what they want from this scheme anyway (apart from the 20% of people who don't have a passport that is)
Get the ID card bill pushed through
Then find out how much it's going to cost
If the LSE proves to be closer to the mark they will can it because the biometric passport thing which we (they) are already committed to pretty much does what they want from this scheme anyway (apart from the 20% of people who don't have a passport that is)
Barclay (Dark Angel)
Ninja Hippy
So, who's prepared to go to prison for refusing it? It's a serious question, because we already know the govt doesn't listen, and that as a consequence "legitimate" protest is useless.
Call me a coward if you like, but whilst I see this as vital, I have others to think about who would be devasted, and my own personal commitments and ambitions that I'd like to persue. Even a relatively short time in prison would screw it all royally.
What an indictment of the political process in the UK. The only way you'll be able to make a difference is by going to prison. Bloody hell....
Hugs,
Barclay
Call me a coward if you like, but whilst I see this as vital, I have others to think about who would be devasted, and my own personal commitments and ambitions that I'd like to persue. Even a relatively short time in prison would screw it all royally.
What an indictment of the political process in the UK. The only way you'll be able to make a difference is by going to prison. Bloody hell....
Hugs,
Barclay
D
dave arc-i
Guest
at some point people will have to make a stand whether it be over this or some other even more serious issue when it comes along and with making a stand inevitably comes some sort of personal loss. is personal freedom worth a loss of personal liberty in pursuit of that freedom?
mickeyblueiiiis
No. 1 Superguy..
Tony Blair is a complete c**t. But in polite society we say Twunt
I personally would not be prepared to go to prison..........as i would lose my Job under the CRB system
I will move to the mountains in Austria, teach snowboarding and have a fucking life
Try and get me there..........not fucking likely
this might well lead to mass civil disobedience something that might finally make the goverment wake up and smell the coffee - what they going to do? bung EVERYBODY in prison after screwing up the court system by completely overloading it? or introduce detention without trial (contrary to human rights) and gthen where they going to put us all - the prison system has only room for about 2 more people currently!
good point there dave..........mind you theres always guantonomo bay
I personally would not be prepared to go to prison..........as i would lose my Job under the CRB system
I will move to the mountains in Austria, teach snowboarding and have a fucking life
Try and get me there..........not fucking likely
this might well lead to mass civil disobedience something that might finally make the goverment wake up and smell the coffee - what they going to do? bung EVERYBODY in prison after screwing up the court system by completely overloading it? or introduce detention without trial (contrary to human rights) and gthen where they going to put us all - the prison system has only room for about 2 more people currently!
good point there dave..........mind you theres always guantonomo bay
Barclay (Dark Angel)
Ninja Hippy
Sure, I'd refuse if I knew for certain that there were hundreds of thousands doing the same thing, but you know what people are like. They say they're going to support a cause, but when push comes to shove, they back out. I don't blame them for not being willing to go to prison, but I'm a bit peeved that they don't / won't stand by their guns.
In the meantime, I too am a member of OWOS, and yes, I do the usual writing letters thing, though I reckon it's just to relieve some of my frustration when I write to Tony Blair, and call him a war criminal. Funny how I never get even an acknowledgement when i do that...
Hugs,
Barclay
In the meantime, I too am a member of OWOS, and yes, I do the usual writing letters thing, though I reckon it's just to relieve some of my frustration when I write to Tony Blair, and call him a war criminal. Funny how I never get even an acknowledgement when i do that...
Hugs,
Barclay
D
dave arc-i
Guest
lets start a proper refusnik campaign then - united we stand, three up in a prison cell......... that sort of thing!
Rhino Plasti
Sailing the Brixton Seas
If you can quantify the population - You can control it.
If you can control the population - you can predict it.
If you can predict what the population will do, you can make money from it.
Too many people are starting to slip out of societies network, which the government cannot allow, else it will loose control.
ID Cards reduce YOU to a number. Thats what you become - digits in a computer - Zero identity - Maximum control.
What a nice bunch of assholes run this country for us.
If you can control the population - you can predict it.
If you can predict what the population will do, you can make money from it.
Too many people are starting to slip out of societies network, which the government cannot allow, else it will loose control.
ID Cards reduce YOU to a number. Thats what you become - digits in a computer - Zero identity - Maximum control.
What a nice bunch of assholes run this country for us.
moonbeam1
Hard as Nails !
peace is war
freedom is slavery
I must say that Im rather dissapointed that these two slogans seem to be particuarly relevant for this conutry atm
freedom is slavery
I must say that Im rather dissapointed that these two slogans seem to be particuarly relevant for this conutry atm
damion
Pound Shop Alex Petridis
maybe one day you will? for a bit. it's going to get you someday, mark my words
mickeyblueiiiis
No. 1 Superguy..
Just released on Radio 1.....cos i'm in the workshop, innit
Tony Blair feels that he can get public support for this scheme............................the price will be 239 quid
Not in my fucking lifetime...........i had my ID card when i served your tinpot goverment in the Army...i gave you the fucker back when i left now fuck off.
*sorry rant over smiley*
Tony Blair feels that he can get public support for this scheme............................the price will be 239 quid
Not in my fucking lifetime...........i had my ID card when i served your tinpot goverment in the Army...i gave you the fucker back when i left now fuck off.
*sorry rant over smiley*
^ I'd really rather not... and not cos of ID cards... but because... I love my hoodie 
My hoodie and I are inseparable... and we object to Blair. My hoodie and I are working on a plan for world domination. This plan involves the shady covering of faces. It must be fostered in a face-shading-friendly country.
MickeyBlueiiis - that's insane, that would be more than AU$500. There's no way everyone could afford that. So many groups would be opposing this - who is supporting it?
OWOS website has a lot of good ideas and links... if/when this starts getting pushed in Aus I hope there's a similar resource for people to use
This is just scary - What information will be stored in the Register and on the Card?
resistance is useful.
My hoodie and I are inseparable... and we object to Blair. My hoodie and I are working on a plan for world domination. This plan involves the shady covering of faces. It must be fostered in a face-shading-friendly country.
MickeyBlueiiis - that's insane, that would be more than AU$500. There's no way everyone could afford that. So many groups would be opposing this - who is supporting it?
OWOS website has a lot of good ideas and links... if/when this starts getting pushed in Aus I hope there's a similar resource for people to use
This is just scary - What information will be stored in the Register and on the Card?
resistance is useful.
D
dave arc-i
Guest
Kezpipa said:
thats if you take the 239.00 BUT the London School of economics reckon the worst case scenaio will see the card at 300.00gbp - and this is the card you will need to get welfare benefits - talk about disenfranchise the most disenfranchised - in real terms you are talking about 4 weeks complete income for a pensioner on state pension and no other income - bet they are all really pleased about going off and fighting for our "freedoms" now
Zero-G
Zero-G
2 can play this game.....
the govenrmant want to sell information about us to the private sector..........but i don't think they realise how many people would then be prepared to sell info about the government to the active(ist) sector......hehehe
everyone should TAKE ACTION NOW..........write to local MP's write to everyone you can, and we should organise protests asap because even if the government get the bill through and then realise it costs too much, they may will be able to bring in the compulsory ID cards anytime in the future when they can do it cheaper...
the govenrmant want to sell information about us to the private sector..........but i don't think they realise how many people would then be prepared to sell info about the government to the active(ist) sector......hehehe
everyone should TAKE ACTION NOW..........write to local MP's write to everyone you can, and we should organise protests asap because even if the government get the bill through and then realise it costs too much, they may will be able to bring in the compulsory ID cards anytime in the future when they can do it cheaper...