Panning?

jibberer

Jibbering Wreck
It doesn't seem to be discussed much, but how much do you use panning as a means to improve your mix (ie not just cool effects)? Is it a valid way to try and clear things out a bit, and stop certain sounds from canceling each other out? Obviously the kick and bass should be dead center, and the mix shouldn't be lop sided, but does any one have any tips on how to approach it or is it not that important?:ismile:
 

jibberer

Jibbering Wreck
S Cube said:
Well usually when i have a part that is really busy i use the Waves S1-Imager to give each sound its space..You could also use stereo imaging on some of your percussion..
So generally you have everything panned to the center? Do you not offset say some leads slightly to the left, and some to the right? Why use a stereo imager plugin, rather than just the pan control in the mixer? Thanks!:ismile:
 

Getafix

Bass Freak
Well basically what you do is widen and/or tilt the stereo image of a sound so that it stands out in the mix..I'm sure there are other plug-in's that allow you to do the same..

 

Getafix

Bass Freak
:Smile3: I guess we were typing at the same time! As for why you would use a plugin instead of panning on the mixer, the plugin is useful not just for panning but for widening the stereo image as well, leaving space for sounds in the centre..I don't know if this would be possible using the mixer..
 

jibberer

Jibbering Wreck
How does that work? I thought a sound's position in the stereo field was just controlled by the relative volumes coming from the left and right speakers? What parameters widen the stereo image?
 

Getafix

Bass Freak
Well you can use the "width" option to widen the image..As for how this stuff really works, i don't wanna talk out of my arse so i'll leave it to the techies for the in-depth explanation!

 

Missing-Link

looking forward
Well...while you lot are on the subject...
Maybe i am behing a bit special but when in Psy you get the noises that come in (when i have head phones on) and go from one hear across my head to the other ... i try this but i can never get it right just using the mixer in logic...

you guys have any tips... i dont know if im pannign to far L & R maybe?
 

Getafix

Bass Freak
Missing-Link said:
Well...while you lot are on the subject...
Maybe i am behing a bit special but when in Psy you get the noises that come in (when i have head phones on) and go from one hear across my head to the other ... i try this but i can never get it right just using the mixer in logic...

you guys have any tips... i dont know if im pannign to far L & R maybe?

Yup there's a waves plugin that does that too! Its called Waves doppler..

 

Gibbonflux

Boom Boom Boom
I wouldn't bother using the S1 for psytrance if I were you. It creates a widening effect on stereo signals by feeding each channel to the opposing channel out of phase, but for this to work you need to be equidistant from the two loudspeakers: not something which you can guarantee when most of your listeners are going to be somewhere random on a dancefloor with a couple of widely spaced PA speakers.

In fact any subtle stereo panning is unlikely to work in this situation, so I think it's generally a good idea to keep important sounds panned to the centre, and use stereo for spatial effect only (e.g. panning delays, reverb)
 

BeatNik

DJohn Mustard Project
Personally I'd use S1 very very sparingly on particular sounds in the final stages of mixing down... Gibbonflux is right about how it works...

The problem can be phasing when the track is converted to mono - not good if your track gets played out on a mono rig! (which I think ~J~, however subtly, was talking about hehe :P - panning everything hard left = true mono)

Anyway, consider your mix a 3D box without gravity... in which you can put an infinite amount of things (it's a wicked paradox)...

In this box, the most important parts of each thing need to be 'visible'... so if you have one slim object in the centre, you can have things either side of it, and below or above it, and they won't be obscured :Smile3:...

i.e. pan something left or right, or e.q. it above or below... it doesn't matter if things overlap (they inevitably do) - but the most important parts need to be seen :Smile3:

I hope this analogy makes some sense!
 

Getafix

Bass Freak
Hmmm so i was under the misconception that using S1 was equivalent to panning something left or right..Would checking the final mix in mono be the same as playing it on a mono rig?
 

Gibbonflux

Boom Boom Boom
Actually S1 can do a few things. It can pan the sound (but if that's all you're using it for you might as well use the mixer's pan pot)...and it can control the width of a stereo signal using M/S processing.

What I was trying to say however is that stereo (i.e. being able to position "phantom images" of sounds at any point between the two speakers) doesn't really work unless the listener is correctly positioned in relation to the loudspeakers.


Obviously when listening to music through a big PA where the speaker stacks are a long way apart, stereo isn't going to work...if you pan important sounds then people are going to hear a different balance depending on which speaker stack is nearer, which is probably not a good thing.

As for checking mixes in mono, that's definitely a good idea
 

ichabod

Member
I havn't tried it but I reckon this kind of stereo processing would be usefull on big pads and fx and even on those big wide lead sounds you get in psytrance. If the stereo positioning works by delaying one channel with repect to the other then it will help widen out these kinds of sounds nicely IMO.
 

BeatNik

DJohn Mustard Project
To be honest i think stereo placement is important when making music... even psytrance for the dancefloor... as even though you need to be exactly in middle for it to work perfectly, the aim is still to provide and immersive soundscape for the listener. Which panning allows...

Otherwise you might as well mix everything in mono!...
 
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